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New System for Handling Films Marked as Adult

Recently, a lot of sexploitation and other classic exploitation and cult films have been removed from Letterboxd because someone on TMDB has been marking them as Adult. I think that the process of importing titles needs to be rethought, because it is drastically affecting my abilities to keep track of my lists and reviews, and it really hurts to see titles disappear after I have put effort into writing reviews and managing lists.

Something really needs to be done about this, because this has continued to be an issue since I first started using the site, and so far there has been no solution to these issues.

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    Turner Stewart shared this idea  ·   ·  Flag idea as inappropriate…  ·  Admin →
    under review  ·  AdminMatthew Buchanan (Admin, Letterboxd) responded  · 

    Let’s do this: can someone in this thread compile a list of “important/historically significant” adult films that should be on LB. Then we can see about adding an exceptions list to our importer that uses this list.

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      • AdminMatthew Buchanan (Admin, Letterboxd) commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        @Nick Sorry, it’s been reclassified as Adult by another TMDb moderator, so got removed again. We don't have the resources to look into it further, I’d suggest approaching someone in their forums if it’s definitely miscategorized.

      • Nick commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        The link doesn't seem to work and the film still doesn't show up when you click on Andrea Bianchi's name.

      • Nick commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        'Malabimba' (1979) isn't available to add on Letterboxd because Tmdb has it marked as adult even though it is an Italian possession/horror film with a couple harder scenes. This film has been put out by Severin films and can be purchased on any online site. This is the kind of film that shouldn't be limited. It's one of my favorite erotic horror films and I can't add it to my page.

      • M Kitchell commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        I feel like there's something inherently limiting to the idea that a film has to be on a pre-approved list to be considered important or historically significant, because it entirely precludes the possibility of discovery--especially in a zeitgeist where lost or forgotten films are re-found and re-discovered almost every day, I feel like it's difficult to make any list that would be all inclusive.

        One potential solution would be to just allow all adult film made before video took over the the pornography industry (which someone with more historical knowledge than me should jump in on, but I'd suggest somewhere around '86 to '88 probably), while having a list of pre-approved films that would follow after that. I would expect 95% of what people would want to be logging and discussing would qualify under this sort of rubric, and then it'd be much easier to come up with a much shorter list that is just '88 to now (similarly, I would believe that films from the dawning of the genre to the switch to video as a primary medium would be where the undiscovered gems are sitting, since economically there was a lot less need for any sort of experimentation or narrative once video hit). This also would inherently allow almost everything listed thus far.

        Off the top of my head, here relevant post-video titles could pretty easily be culled from the chapter on "New Wave Pornography" in David Flint's book BABYLON BLUE from Creation Cinema. This is a lot of work along the lines of what was made by David Blake, Michael Ninn--who made both all male & much more famous heterosexual pornography, the Dark Brothers (and of course Rinse Dream's oeuvre shouldn't be cut off at a certain date).

        This brings up a related issue, and something especially relevant to Letterboxd--there are a number of auteurs who worked occasionally in pornography. Abel Ferrara, Roger Watkins, Jess Franco, Jean Rollin, Jose Benezeraf, and many more, and not being able to discuss certain works by important film directors closes out some of the more dynamic elements of their careers.

        With all that being said, if a "comprehensive list" is really needed, I'd request that we're allowed some time to actually attempt to collectively throw this together, as I know I at least would want to comb through the large number of reference books on the subject, internet message boards, and just look at what's available before anything set in stone occurs.

      • C.A. Hall commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        How about any classic erotic films that have been recently released on blu-ray/dvd by reputable video distributors

      • hill89 commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Just in case you can't open that One Drive from my previous comment, I'll paste it here. The number to the right is the year for each one.

        Night Trips 1989
        Nothing to Hide 1981
        Latex and Latex 2:Shock 1995
        Behind the Green Door 1972
        Nothing to Hide 2: Justine 1992
        Bobby Sox 1996
        Buttman's European Vacation 1991
        Opening of Misty Beethoven, The 1976
        John Leslie's Dog Walker 1993
        Scoundrels 1982
        Devil in Miss Jones 3 and 4, The 1986
        Insatiable 1980
        Drop Sex 1997
        Debbie Does Dallas 1978
        Café Flesh 1982
        Sex World 1978
        New Wave Hookers 1986
        Devil in Miss Jones 1973
        Face Dance Part 1 and 2 1992
        Bad Wives 1997
        Taboo 1980
        Voyeur 5, The 1995
        Talk Dirty to Me 1980
        Chameleons: Not the Sequel 1993
        Bottom Dweller 1993
        Zazel 1997
        Sex and Sex 2:Fate 1994
        Buttslammers 1993
        Never So Deep 1981
        Bad Girls 1981
        Neon Nights 1981
        Body & Soul 1999
        Between the Cheeks 2 1990
        Fresh Meat: A Ghost Story 1995
        Adventures of Buttman, The 1989
        Rocco: Animal Trainer 3 2000
        3 A.M.:The Time of Sexuality 1975
        Double Feature! 1999
        Resurrection of Eve, The 1973
        In Defense of Savannah: On Trial 1991
        Deep Throat 1972
        History of the Blue Movie, A 1970
        Reel People 1984
        Euro Angels 1997
        Ecstacy Girls, The 1979
        House of Dreams 1990
        SodoMania 1:Tales of Perversity 1992
        Hidden Obsessions 1992
        Private Video Magazine 1 1992
        Kinky Business 1984
        X Factor 1984
        Wild Things 1985
        Up & Cummers: The Movie 1994
        Pyramid 1, 2, and 3, The 1996
        Jekyll & Hyde 2000
        Beauties in Paradise 1993
        Blue Movie 1995
        American Tushy 1996
        Café Flesh 2 1997
        Dark Garden 1999
        New Wave Hookers 4 1995
        Night Dreams 1981
        Slave to Love 1993
        Clockwork Orgy 1995
        Pussyman 5: Captive Audience 1994
        Wild Goose Chase 1991
        Dark Angels 2000
        Cheeks 2: The Bitter End 1989
        Secret Garden, The 1993
        World Sex Tour 1 1995
        My Bare Lady 1989
        Realities 1991
        Sensual Escape 1988
        Firestorm 1, 2, and 3 1987
        Farmer's Daughters: The Movie 1986
        Amanda By Night 1981
        Looker 1998
        Blame It on Ginger 1986
        Bus Stop Tales 1989
        Sorority Sweethearts 1983
        White Women 1986
        Two Women 1992
        Masseuse, The 1990
        Conflict 1988
        Red Vibe Diaries: Object of Desire 1997
        Texas Dildo Masquerade, The 1998
        Raw Talent 1984
        All That Sex 1990
        Hustler XXX Video 1 2000
        Satisfiers of Alpha Blue, The 1980
        Ben Dover's Banned in Britain 1995
        Sorority Sex Kittens 1 1995
        Dinner Party, The 1994
        Watchers 2000
        Perverted Stories 1: Where Fantasy Becomes Reality 1995
        Depraved Fantasies 1994
        Skin (Die prufung) 1994
        Conquest 1996
        West Side 2000
        Underworld 2001
        Naked Came the Stranger 1975

      • hill89 commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        "Beyond the Green Door" that Cliff mentioned should be "Behind the Green Door", unless there's another movie that I haven't heard of and can't find. Some that I'll add:

        Water Power (1977)
        Aunt Peg
        Aunt Peg Goes to Hollywood
        Aunt Peg's Corruption
        Taboo (1980)
        Taboo II (1982)
        Taboo III (1984)
        Teenage Twins (1976)
        Pirates (2005)
        Pirates II: Stagnetti's Revenge (2008)

        Some already mentioned below, but I'll add them to an actual list:
        Long Jeanne Silver
        Nightdreams (1981)

        This will probably have some cross over with what's already been mentioned, but I found a list some one made for what AVN voted as the 101 best adult movies. I think the fact that they're considered the best by what's essentially the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences of the adult film world means that they should at least be taken into consideration. The list can be found at https://onedrive.live.com/view.aspx?resid=320BC2737BD0BAC8!246&cid=320bc2737bd0bac8&app=Excel&authkey=!AAN_IWh_Odh2DXg.

        While I think adding films on an individual basis could word for now, I still think the best option will be to allow people to choose whether or not to filter out adult content, but that's just a suggestion.

      • Cliff commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Surely this can be a group effort. I'll start things off:

        Deep Throat
        Debbie Does Dallas
        Beyond the Green Door
        The Devil in Miss Jones
        The Opening of Misty Beethoven
        Through the Looking Glass
        Café Flesh
        Corruption
        Thundercrack!

        Probably anything put out by legit cineaste labels like Synapse and Vinegar Syndrome.

      • hill89 commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Is the plan to do it on a film by film basis? If so, I think a good idea would be maybe just a simple page where people can recommend movies to be added to the exception list so that we're not creating a big jumbled list here, but I'll try to come up with some soon to help get things started.

      • AdminMatthew Buchanan (Admin, Letterboxd) commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Let’s do this: can someone in this thread compile a list of “important/historically significant” adult films that should be on LB. Then we can see about adding an exceptions list to our importer that uses this list.

      • fiffy_rico commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        This is really vital. As others have mentioned, there are plenty of porn films that are unquestionably important to cinematic history. This policy simply reproduces the a priori assumption that any and all "porn" is inherently "less cinematic" than even the trashiest, goriest, most violent exploitation crap (speaking as someone who loves that stuff too!). As long as it doesn't have too much bewbs or unsimulated doing-it! I don't even like porn but argh I feel like I have to defend it here.

        But all of this stuff is valid, especially especially to those researching representation of sexuality and gender (ok ok and ppl who just wanna catalogue their spankbanks I guess, WHATEVER!). I mean, we don't need to include a bunch of gonzo scenes, right? But even fairly recent feature-length stuff like the Pirates of the Caribbean parody should be included imo.
        [I'm not sure if I can make a proper philosophical distinction between gonzo scenes with threadbare, repetitive narrative gestures and full-length porn parodies without undercutting my smartypants "a priori" argument above but at least we need to start with the stuff we know has had historical impact, like the titles already mentioned in this thread.]

      • Alex commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        What is "straight pornographic material"? Gonzo porn from the web? It's clear to me that these are not FILMS.

        But films like "Long Jeanne Silver" or "The Opening of Misty Beethoven" certainly are, and gravely important ones at that. Thus they should be made available, as well as any other pornographic work that can be regarded as being a FILM. If this keeps getting ignored, you're excluding a huge section of world cinema. And I'm still not sure why. If needed, some form of "adult profile" should be easily implemented. Apart from that, it's hard to fathom that any child or adult will get corrupted by discussions about a 40 year old John Holmes film. I thought this site was about sharing the love of cinema. I'm sorry, but from its inception cinema includes pornography.

      • AdminMatthew Buchanan (Admin, Letterboxd) commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Cult films with adult elements should not be marked as Adult on TMDb, as far as we aware. This flag is meant for straight pornographic material.

        It’s possible we can override the Adult flag in certain cases where films are of historical significance but where TMDb insists they are Adult. I do not have a timeframe for this work, however.

      • Sean commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        It should be trivial to allow for a flag to be set to movies marked as 'adult' that could be filtered out of default search results unless a user is logged in and confirms their age is over 18. This would allow your core user base, many of whom are exploitation/cult movie fans, to continue to review/discuss important cult films that happen to have adult elements in them.

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